Citizens Liberty Organization / 🌎 Global Channels / 📜member-chat [part 33]

That is true. Even for armed security.

> Stand your ground law is not a blanket statement to say that you don’t ever have to move. It removes the duty to *retreat away from danger* > If you stand there and cause escalation when you could have walked away, that has nothing to do with stand your ground @Crye Salesman well I'm not obviously going to stand in their face I'm going to try to walk further towards where I want to go and if they follow me or physically stop me they are in the wrong

A court can find a motherfucker threatening me, for walking, guilty of being dead as fuck, there aren't any if, ands, or buts about it another man does not get to dictate what I do or when I do it, yes there are consequences but you either deal with it or let tyrants go unchecked

@Cannibal1-1 > A court can find a motherfucker threatening me, for walking, guilty of being dead as fuck, there aren't any if, ands, or buts about it another man does not get to dictate what I do or when I do it, yes there are consequences but you either deal with it or let tyrants go unchecked @Cannibal1-1 sounds awful authoritarian to me

Even if you’re justified you’ll still end up in prison and your normal life will be over

Hurr durr let's instigate a fight where I can shoot someone simply because why not?

In this case, you are very, very clearly, creating an violent encounter where there was not one before, and you’re knowingly entering this situation to cause this reaction. You will be held at fault.

I'm sorry, the fuck do you mean sounds authoritarian? I'm not telling him what to do he tried telling me what to do

I'm sorry but walking down the public Street going around the people that are trying to provoke me into violence or are being violent towards me does not make me guilty of anything

If I Stay talking to them yes that'd be provoking escalating the situation if I'm actively trying to evade them will go in about my day as a free Citizen and a free public area that I paid for with my taxes

Your gonna ice someone for telling you to walk somewhere else. That's pretty authoritarian bro whether you think so or not

Except there gonna have these messages on a fucking powerpoint in the courtroom and say “look, he went there to cause trouble, and everyone told him not too”

Then I obviously I'm trying to not escalate it

I never said I'm trying to start trouble, I said I was going there to collect Intel is a great man and a great man is someone who is blending in with crowd

https://youtu.be/MBLji5dMS_k

Everyone should watch that before they get hot on anything

I believe in NH you can defend a third party if their life is being threatened. You can absolutely shoot to kill if someone is in your house

But if by some means they're actively and forcefully trying to remove me from there then I will try to avoid them and if they use violence against me I will defend my self

Stand your ground law Nh look it up.

Telling me is one thing, trying to enforce what they said is another, I assumed you'd have the brain power to infer that

Yes granite you’re right

The house thing there is still more nuanced @GRANITE

Referring to Castle Law a whole nother subject

Castle law only applies to your place of dwelling

Thats what I'm referring to

"A man's home is his castle and he can defend it any way he sees fit" TLDR of Oklahoma Castle Doctrine

Well it’s the same thing, kind of. All castle *doctrine* does is remove your obligation to *retreat from danger* when inside your home. For example, if an old dementia patient walks through your front door, and you smoke check him, hello prison, Castle law or not. Unarmed teen breaks into your garage to steal your car and you smoke him? Prison

They still have to be a clear danger to your person

> Castle law only applies to your place of dwelling @Cannibal1-1 I love Louisiana. Castle law here applies to your car if you're in it as well.

Besides the machine gun and bump stock laws NH has just about zero infringements and hopefully it stays that way

I've had fun gentleman but I must go attend to my laundry. Someone else please take emoji penut gallery.

In literally zero states does Castle doctrine mean “as soon as someone crosses the threshold of my domain, I can kill them” Not fucking one.

Dead men tell no tells and if you say they attempted to attack you then that's that

Don't quote me but I thought Texas had something like that

So is anyone actually gathering Intel in CHAZ or are we all gonna sit here and argue about the legality of murder

> In literally zero states does Castle doctrine mean “as soon as someone crosses the threshold of my domain, I can kill them” > Not fucking one. @Crye Salesman If I'm Not mistaken in Louisiana you can. Just can't shoot em in the back.

You are super mistaken

From the second they attempt forced entry

Forcing entry changes things slightly (like if they where literally kicking your door in) but their presence in side your home is *not* a justification for lethal force, anywhere in the US

Crye, if it meant that then any thief that breaks into a house could grt the home owner charged with attempted murder, no court is going to side with someone who entered a residence uninvited and got merked

I learned use of force and deadly force for security. We used the same guy as the police here. That's about what he told us.

> Crye, if it meant that then any thief that breaks into a house could grt the home owner charged with attempted murder, no court is going to side with someone who entered a residence uninvited and got merked @Cannibal1-1 wrong. You’re assuming and assuming is very bad

You can’t say no court unless you’ve been in every court

So if I go enter a house and the home owner tries to kill me I can charge them with attempted murder

That’s actually a thing that people go to prison for *frequently*

Yes

The law isn’t always so black and white. There’s a lot of stuff you actually have to prove. And intent is hard to prove

@Cannibal1-1 used to be able to sue the home owner for damages in Calif. Thats what started the castle laws

Hmm, so even cali agrees entering a home univited is a bad idea

I don't know what the laws are there now

For example, if you say he was armed, and the court finds that no lights were turned on, and you had no light on your gun, you could go to prison because you didn’t *know* that he was armed, whether he was armed or not is irrelevant

That's why you don't say s*** until you get a lawyer

What the lawyer decide what you should and shouldn't say because self-incrimination is the biggest factor to getting locked away for self-defense

To bad sihlouttes exist and windows let in ambient light enough to see the outline of a person

That’s definitely true @Mando

> For example, if you say he was armed, and the court finds that no lights were turned on, and you had no light on your gun, you could go to prison because you didn’t *know* that he was armed, whether he was armed or not is irrelevant @Crye Salesman "Officer I stopped a threat. " That's all you say until you get your lawyer

Security 101

Definitely the right page on the lawyer thing guys

No don't say s*** until you have a lawyer that's regardless you're going to have to have one for court so just wait until he talks to you

> To bad sihlouttes exist and windows let in ambient light enough to see the outline of a person @Cannibal1-1 you’d have to prove he was in front of a window and that you saw the distinct outline of a weapon, and prove he had intent to use it on you

That would be my word against a deadman's then

That’s actually cool @Potatoes O'Reilly

Lesson one of the day just wait for a f****** lawyer it's not hard to shut your mouth

> That would be my word against a deadman's then @Cannibal1-1 no, it would be your word against the evidence

> No don't say s*** until you have a lawyer that's regardless you're going to have to have one for court so just wait until he talks to you @Mando nothing wrong with that. I've got training in how to respond after with the police so I'll stick with that and frame it as self defense without saying anything more than that that could be misconstrued.

Prove he wasn't infront of a window before he moved to the position he was in when he was put down

NHs stand your ground law is just that. Not a castle doctrine. It is very lenient

I mean the “stand your ground law” can’t be lenient, that means one exact thing, probably what you have is lenient prosecutors

Or juries who are reasonable

You must be from commie occupied America

Coming in hot

New Hampshire currently has a “stand your ground" law. This law regulates when and where New Hampshire citizens can use deadly force in self-defense. New Hampshire law allows the use of deadly force against another person in the following situations: When a person is about to use deadly force against you or someone else; If a person is likely to use unlawful force while committing a burglary; If a person is in the process of committing a kidnapping or forcible sex act; If a person is likely to use unlawful force while committing a felony against someone in their own home or on the surrounding property. “Stand your ground” laws allow citizens to use deadly force in these four situations not just inside their home, but wherever they have a legal right to be.

But yea just because someone is in the house doesn’t mean you can blast them

But if someone is in your house unwanted, chances are they just committed a felony

Unlawful force isn't nessicarily deadly force...

Tresspassers will be shot signs exist for a reason

Js

Well, I wouldn’t make that assumption. What if they’re someone’s grandad who walked into the wrong house? A autistic teenager?

Well yea dude lol

> Tresspassers will be shot signs exist for a reason @Cannibal1-1 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 There is nothing in the world with less meaning than that

I’m not talking about shooting a granddad or my autistic cousin

@GRANITE I wasn’t saying you didn’t know that, just providing nuance for the audience ya know

Yup judgement will always be at the forefront

@GRANITE we need to make a subsection message board that specifically has info on each States legal codes on self-defense

If you can’t decide the different between a threat and non threat you shouldn’t be carrying a firearm

Il move it to server recommendations

As said before you can legally be in the right but still go to jail

Probably good to have one I'm de-escelation tactics as well.

On*

You seem to assume that we are gonna immediatly shoot anyone in our homes without threat assesment, but since I keep my door and windows locked constantly you'd have to try hard enough to get in that it's likely you aren't just mistaken

Still. If you’re gonna rely on the courts to bail you out or take your side you’re a fool

I think what he is trying to say is if he feels like his life is in danger he is just stating he's not afraid to take reasonable reaction

So in other news now I'm getting sponsored ads for Hawaiian Shirts

The prior implication was definitely that stand your ground/caste law was a reason to articulate your use of force, when other factors had not been prevailing

Oh fuck no, I expect them to throw me specifically under the bus but at the same time it's just as likely that I'd get set loose

My wrist hurts. Anyone know what might be wrong?

> My wrist hurts. Anyone know what might be wrong? @Thecoolnerd98 too much masturbation?

We got a fed boy

Work out more jack off less

I cant grab a rifle correctly